Opening Pandora’s Apartheid Box - Part 29 – Secret talks with the Enemy
By Mike Smith
30th of March 2011
30th of March 2011
Today when one observes online forums and newspaper columns, most white South Africans believe that we were sold out and betrayed by the negotiators F.W. de Klerk, Roelf Meyer, Pik Botha, et al at the Codesa talks.
The truth is rather different. What we as the public saw at the Codesa talks were merely a puppet show. It was an act. What we saw was a deception to make the South African public and the world believe that “meaningful negotiations” were underway.
The breakdown of the talks; the public holding their breaths; the negotiators taking hands and starting the talks again…followed by another breakdown in talks; threats to pull out…the country on the brink of civil war; more gasps from the public, etc, etc…It was all show. A psychological trick.
The real negotiations between the NP government and the ANC took place years before that already. By the time of Codesa, the spoils were already divided.
Let me explain…
Although denouncing Mandela as an arch Marxist committed to violent revolution, P.W. Botha in order to curry favour with blacks in South Africa and to show the world that Mandela was being treated well moved Mandela in 1985 from Robben Island to Polsmoor outside of Cape Town. In those days still a decent prison.
In January 1985 in an address to the House of Assembly, Botha offered to free Mandela on condition that Mandela pledge opposition to acts of violence to further political objectives.
Mandela’s daughter Zinzi read his reply. Mandela said that the government was responsible for the violence. If there was a democracy there would not be any need for violence.
Ironically history today shows that the further South Africa moved away from Apartheid and closer to a multiracial democracy, the more the violence increased and now, 17 years after the introduction of such a democracy, violence, murder, rape, etc is at an all time high in South Africa, far worse than during any period of Apartheid.
In December 1988, Mandela was moved to a four-bedroom house of his own complete with a swimming pool and shaded by fir trees, on a prison farm called Victor Verster, near Paarl, just outside of Cape Town. He could also receive visitors as he pleased and his wife Winnie could sleep over, an offer she declined.
To the public of South Africa, the NP showed defiance and refused to talk to terrorists, but behind the scenes secret talks with the ANC Marxist terrorists were already in full swing.
The truth is rather different. What we as the public saw at the Codesa talks were merely a puppet show. It was an act. What we saw was a deception to make the South African public and the world believe that “meaningful negotiations” were underway.
The breakdown of the talks; the public holding their breaths; the negotiators taking hands and starting the talks again…followed by another breakdown in talks; threats to pull out…the country on the brink of civil war; more gasps from the public, etc, etc…It was all show. A psychological trick.
The real negotiations between the NP government and the ANC took place years before that already. By the time of Codesa, the spoils were already divided.
Let me explain…
Although denouncing Mandela as an arch Marxist committed to violent revolution, P.W. Botha in order to curry favour with blacks in South Africa and to show the world that Mandela was being treated well moved Mandela in 1985 from Robben Island to Polsmoor outside of Cape Town. In those days still a decent prison.
In January 1985 in an address to the House of Assembly, Botha offered to free Mandela on condition that Mandela pledge opposition to acts of violence to further political objectives.
Mandela’s daughter Zinzi read his reply. Mandela said that the government was responsible for the violence. If there was a democracy there would not be any need for violence.
Ironically history today shows that the further South Africa moved away from Apartheid and closer to a multiracial democracy, the more the violence increased and now, 17 years after the introduction of such a democracy, violence, murder, rape, etc is at an all time high in South Africa, far worse than during any period of Apartheid.
In December 1988, Mandela was moved to a four-bedroom house of his own complete with a swimming pool and shaded by fir trees, on a prison farm called Victor Verster, near Paarl, just outside of Cape Town. He could also receive visitors as he pleased and his wife Winnie could sleep over, an offer she declined.
To the public of South Africa, the NP showed defiance and refused to talk to terrorists, but behind the scenes secret talks with the ANC Marxist terrorists were already in full swing.
Professor Sampie Terreblanche of Stellenbosch University : http://www.stellenboschwriters.com/terreblanche.html
was involved in clandestine meetings with the ANC at the end of the 1980s. In 1985 the members of staff of Stellenbosch founded the "Discussion group '85" of which he became the chairman. They felt that the South-African government was on the wrong track. Sampie Terreblanche ended his membership of the NP in 1987 and became one of their strongest critics. He was a founding member of the DP and its first economic adviser, but is now no longer active in party politics.
Former Deputy Minister for Defence and National Intelligence and, since 1980, Justice Minister, Kobie Coetsee, already started secret talks with Mandela in 1985 under directorship of National Intelligence Services.
He met Mandela in the hospital while Mandela was being treated for prostate surgery.
Over the next four years, a series of tentative meetings took place, laying the groundwork for further contact and future negotiations.
Prof. Willie Esterhuyse, a prominent academic of Stellenbosch University, met Thabo Mbeki in England in 1987 and was told to report back to National Intelligence Services (NIS).
In 1988 more talks followed between Mbeki and around 20 members of the political elite of South Africa.
NIS director Dr. Niel Barnard and his deputy Mike Louw were already having many secret talks with Mandela at the time, Barbard recalled in all, 48 meetings...... http://www.beeld.com/Suid-Afrika/Nuus/Gesprek-nie-oor-morele-beginsel-20100210
Barnard also met Thabo Mbeki, Jacob Zuma and Aziz Pahad in Bern, Switzerland in 1989.
NIS also organized what became known as the Dakar Safari . The Institute for a Democratic Alternative for South Africa (Idasa) and a group of fifty-two mainly Afrikaans-speaking intellectuals, sixty-one in total, conferred with the banned ANC in Dakar, Senegal, from 9-12 July. Delegates were drawn from academic, professional, cultural, religious and business fields. The seventeen-person ANC delegation was headed by Thabo Mbeki.
Amongst the delegates from South Africa were Tony Bloom, Dr F. van Zyl Slabbert, Willie Esterhuyse, Dr. Theuns Eloff, Breyten Breytenbach, Andre P. Brink, Ampie Coetsee, Andre du Toit, Jannie Gagiano, Herman Gilliomee, Max du Preez, Rashied Lombard, Jimmy Matthews, Hennie Serfontein, Alistair Sparks, Alex Boraine and Gretha Fox.
Gretha Fox? She was an actress…why did she have to go along?
On the surface the National Party was protesting heavily whilst already in talks of their own with the ANC.
In his book, “Really inside BOSS: a tale of South Africa’s late intelligence service”, P.C. Swanepoel writes on page 49 that since 1986 the Chairman of the Afrikaner Broederbond, Pieter de Lange had been meeting secretly with the ANC and that for two and a half years from November 1987 until May 1990 the Afrikaner Broederbond held twelve such clandestine meetings with the ANC. Amongst these influential Broederbonders were, Prof Sampie Terreblanche, Wimpie de Klerk (former Dutch Reformed Minister, lecturer, newspaper editor of Rapport and The Transvaler and also the liberal brother of president F.W. de Klerk), Prof Willie Esterhuyse and others.
These meetings took place at a luxury mansion that belonged to and were sponsored by Rudolph Agnew, Chairman of the British mining house Consolidated Goldfields.
Wimpie de Klerk described these events in his diary as follows.
“For me personally they meant a great deal; The luxury trips and accommodation; The experience of sitting close to the fire and engaging in political breakthrough work to bring the National Party and the ANC to dialogue; The bonds of friendships that developed between Thabo Mbeki, Aziz Pahad, Jacob Zuma and myself; The access to direct confidential information; The position of intermediary, because from the beginning until now I have conveyed “secret messages” from the ANC to F.W. and even the other way around, but F.W. was and is very cautious…”
In his book “Tomorrow is another country”, the journalist Alister Sparks writes on page 86, that Prof. Willie Esterhuyse after those experiences taught his political science students that, “Negotiations do not always have to be formal; You can use Glenfiddich to solve a problem.”
It was also Niel Barnard’s NIS who smuggled the first bunch of Marxist exiles amongst others, Mbeki and Zuma, back into the country and put them up in a safe house in Pretoria North, without the knowledge of the security police. This was a blatant act of treason and downright criminal.
In the BBC Radio4 program, “The Reunion” Barnard remarks, “all good intelligence agencies should be ahead of their governments.”
He was referring to the South African NIS who repeatedly urged the Nationalist government to find a way to talk to the ANC.
Barnard was also famous for tying Nelson Mandela’s shoe laces before he was due to meet PW Botha for the first time. This incident is also discussed in The Reunion
Later on Prof Willie Esterhuyse would write about his experiences and meetings in English pubs with the Communist enemies of South Africa and how South Africa’s super spies laid the table for handing the country over to the Marxist enemies. Willie Esterhuyse was a NIS spy under the Code name “Gert” .
When Mandela was freed from prison on the 11th of February 1989 he wanted Niel Barnard on his side, but Barnard told him, “Sir, this is YOUR moment, besides how is it going to look if you walk out of prison with a Boer Spy?”…
That is what Barnard called himself…”A Boer Spy”. More like “A Boer Traitor” if you ask me. A Hensopper and a Joiner.
In his book, Volksverraad pg 92 Advocate P.J. Pretorius writes, the following in Afrikaans, freely translated directly underneath,
“Toe dit gedurende September 1992 vir NI duidelik word dat die ANC en die SAKP die onderhandelingsoorlog teen die NP wen, het die NI self in die geheim by gespreksvoewring met die ANC en die SAKP betrokke geraak. Omdat intelligensie ‘n lae prioriteit vir die ANC en die SAKP was moes die NI en sy establishment van nagenoeg 5 000 personeellede die wese van die intelligensiewese aan die opkomende bewind bemark. NI se burokratiese posisie was op die spel. NI se hoofbstuur (waaronder Mike Louw, George Grewar, Mikde Kuhn, Eksteen Theron, SED Hofmeyer en Jakes Jacobs), het vroeg in 1993 die ANC en die SAKP op die Diens se geheime eiland in die Vaaldam onthaal om NI se beeld by die ANC en die SAKP te verbeter. ‘n Plan om die regses te vernietig is aan die ANC/SAKP voorgelê ter wille van burokratiese magsvertoon.”
”By September 1992, when it became obvious to National Intelligence that the ANC and the SACP were winning the negotiation war, National Intelligence secretly got involved with talks of their own with the ANC and the SACP. Because intelligence were a low priority for the ANC/SACP, the NI establishment with about 5000 members had to market themselves to the up and coming regime. NI’s bureaucratic position was at stake. NI’s top management (amongst others Mike Louw, George Grewar, Mike Kuhn, Eksteen Theron, SED Hofmeyer and Jakes Jacobs) hosted and entertained the ANC/SACP in 1993 at the Services’ secret island in the Vaal Dam to improve the image of NI with the ANC/SACP. A plan to destroy the right wing was presented to the ANC/SACP as a show of bureaucratic force.
At this stage we have to revisit the legal definition of treason.
“The betrayal of one's own country by waging war against it or by consciously or purposely acting to aid its enemies”
See…it is one thing to fly First Class all over the world making luxury trips to have secret negotiations with the enemy at taxpayer’s expense…it could even be in order to conspire the dividing of the spoils after the Great Betrayal whilst sipping single malts with the enemy around the fire; an enemy who was planting bombs and killing South African citizens…
But it is quite another thing to conscript and send 18 year old boys to go fight a war against Marxist terrorists on the Angolan Border whilst you are abetting and smuggling these same Marxist enemies into South Africa and putting them up in safe houses…at taxpayer’s expense.
While these traitors were conspiring to hand over our country to Marxist terrorist scum, young boys were dying on the Angolan border. When these young conscripts were curled up in their sleeping bags in the bush of Angola, unshaved and stinking from not having bathed for days, these traitors were sipping Whiskey with the enemy around a cozy fireplace inside an English Mansion.
In March 1993, 32 Battalion, a crack Special Forces unit and the most decorated, was disbanded and its members left out on their own devices.
Commandant Willem Ratte asked his wife to sew a small black bag together. He then collected 30 old one Rand coins (for their high silver content) from the former soldiers. Commandant Ratte handed the thirty pieces of silver to the battalion's spokesperson, Louis Bothma, with the request that they be given to President F.W. De Klerk. Willie Snyman was a member of parliament at the time. In this capacity, he handed De Klerk his wages of treason on behalf of the soldiers as a symbol of his Judas treachery to the former soldiers who fought Marxism in the Namibian/Angolan Border. De Klerk, according to reports, was very hurt by this gesture.
I have to say, that when the Director of National Intelligence ties the shoelaces of a convicted Marxist Terrorist and mass murder before secret meetings, then you know…You have been properly screwed over.
But what has happened to Dr. Lukas Daniel (Niel) Barnard since the great betrayal?
Well he seems to have invested his thirty pieces of silver quite well in ACG World: Life at the Top (with a whole lot of Nigerians) if one considers who the trustees are.
Former Deputy Minister for Defence and National Intelligence and, since 1980, Justice Minister, Kobie Coetsee, already started secret talks with Mandela in 1985 under directorship of National Intelligence Services.
He met Mandela in the hospital while Mandela was being treated for prostate surgery.
Over the next four years, a series of tentative meetings took place, laying the groundwork for further contact and future negotiations.
Prof. Willie Esterhuyse, a prominent academic of Stellenbosch University, met Thabo Mbeki in England in 1987 and was told to report back to National Intelligence Services (NIS).
In 1988 more talks followed between Mbeki and around 20 members of the political elite of South Africa.
NIS director Dr. Niel Barnard and his deputy Mike Louw were already having many secret talks with Mandela at the time, Barbard recalled in all, 48 meetings...... http://www.beeld.com/Suid-Afrika/Nuus/Gesprek-nie-oor-morele-beginsel-20100210
Barnard also met Thabo Mbeki, Jacob Zuma and Aziz Pahad in Bern, Switzerland in 1989.
NIS also organized what became known as the Dakar Safari . The Institute for a Democratic Alternative for South Africa (Idasa) and a group of fifty-two mainly Afrikaans-speaking intellectuals, sixty-one in total, conferred with the banned ANC in Dakar, Senegal, from 9-12 July. Delegates were drawn from academic, professional, cultural, religious and business fields. The seventeen-person ANC delegation was headed by Thabo Mbeki.
Amongst the delegates from South Africa were Tony Bloom, Dr F. van Zyl Slabbert, Willie Esterhuyse, Dr. Theuns Eloff, Breyten Breytenbach, Andre P. Brink, Ampie Coetsee, Andre du Toit, Jannie Gagiano, Herman Gilliomee, Max du Preez, Rashied Lombard, Jimmy Matthews, Hennie Serfontein, Alistair Sparks, Alex Boraine and Gretha Fox.
Gretha Fox? She was an actress…why did she have to go along?
On the surface the National Party was protesting heavily whilst already in talks of their own with the ANC.
In his book, “Really inside BOSS: a tale of South Africa’s late intelligence service”, P.C. Swanepoel writes on page 49 that since 1986 the Chairman of the Afrikaner Broederbond, Pieter de Lange had been meeting secretly with the ANC and that for two and a half years from November 1987 until May 1990 the Afrikaner Broederbond held twelve such clandestine meetings with the ANC. Amongst these influential Broederbonders were, Prof Sampie Terreblanche, Wimpie de Klerk (former Dutch Reformed Minister, lecturer, newspaper editor of Rapport and The Transvaler and also the liberal brother of president F.W. de Klerk), Prof Willie Esterhuyse and others.
These meetings took place at a luxury mansion that belonged to and were sponsored by Rudolph Agnew, Chairman of the British mining house Consolidated Goldfields.
Wimpie de Klerk described these events in his diary as follows.
“For me personally they meant a great deal; The luxury trips and accommodation; The experience of sitting close to the fire and engaging in political breakthrough work to bring the National Party and the ANC to dialogue; The bonds of friendships that developed between Thabo Mbeki, Aziz Pahad, Jacob Zuma and myself; The access to direct confidential information; The position of intermediary, because from the beginning until now I have conveyed “secret messages” from the ANC to F.W. and even the other way around, but F.W. was and is very cautious…”
In his book “Tomorrow is another country”, the journalist Alister Sparks writes on page 86, that Prof. Willie Esterhuyse after those experiences taught his political science students that, “Negotiations do not always have to be formal; You can use Glenfiddich to solve a problem.”
It was also Niel Barnard’s NIS who smuggled the first bunch of Marxist exiles amongst others, Mbeki and Zuma, back into the country and put them up in a safe house in Pretoria North, without the knowledge of the security police. This was a blatant act of treason and downright criminal.
In the BBC Radio4 program, “The Reunion” Barnard remarks, “all good intelligence agencies should be ahead of their governments.”
He was referring to the South African NIS who repeatedly urged the Nationalist government to find a way to talk to the ANC.
Barnard was also famous for tying Nelson Mandela’s shoe laces before he was due to meet PW Botha for the first time. This incident is also discussed in The Reunion
Later on Prof Willie Esterhuyse would write about his experiences and meetings in English pubs with the Communist enemies of South Africa and how South Africa’s super spies laid the table for handing the country over to the Marxist enemies. Willie Esterhuyse was a NIS spy under the Code name “Gert” .
When Mandela was freed from prison on the 11th of February 1989 he wanted Niel Barnard on his side, but Barnard told him, “Sir, this is YOUR moment, besides how is it going to look if you walk out of prison with a Boer Spy?”…
That is what Barnard called himself…”A Boer Spy”. More like “A Boer Traitor” if you ask me. A Hensopper and a Joiner.
In his book, Volksverraad pg 92 Advocate P.J. Pretorius writes, the following in Afrikaans, freely translated directly underneath,
“Toe dit gedurende September 1992 vir NI duidelik word dat die ANC en die SAKP die onderhandelingsoorlog teen die NP wen, het die NI self in die geheim by gespreksvoewring met die ANC en die SAKP betrokke geraak. Omdat intelligensie ‘n lae prioriteit vir die ANC en die SAKP was moes die NI en sy establishment van nagenoeg 5 000 personeellede die wese van die intelligensiewese aan die opkomende bewind bemark. NI se burokratiese posisie was op die spel. NI se hoofbstuur (waaronder Mike Louw, George Grewar, Mikde Kuhn, Eksteen Theron, SED Hofmeyer en Jakes Jacobs), het vroeg in 1993 die ANC en die SAKP op die Diens se geheime eiland in die Vaaldam onthaal om NI se beeld by die ANC en die SAKP te verbeter. ‘n Plan om die regses te vernietig is aan die ANC/SAKP voorgelê ter wille van burokratiese magsvertoon.”
”By September 1992, when it became obvious to National Intelligence that the ANC and the SACP were winning the negotiation war, National Intelligence secretly got involved with talks of their own with the ANC and the SACP. Because intelligence were a low priority for the ANC/SACP, the NI establishment with about 5000 members had to market themselves to the up and coming regime. NI’s bureaucratic position was at stake. NI’s top management (amongst others Mike Louw, George Grewar, Mike Kuhn, Eksteen Theron, SED Hofmeyer and Jakes Jacobs) hosted and entertained the ANC/SACP in 1993 at the Services’ secret island in the Vaal Dam to improve the image of NI with the ANC/SACP. A plan to destroy the right wing was presented to the ANC/SACP as a show of bureaucratic force.
At this stage we have to revisit the legal definition of treason.
“The betrayal of one's own country by waging war against it or by consciously or purposely acting to aid its enemies”
See…it is one thing to fly First Class all over the world making luxury trips to have secret negotiations with the enemy at taxpayer’s expense…it could even be in order to conspire the dividing of the spoils after the Great Betrayal whilst sipping single malts with the enemy around the fire; an enemy who was planting bombs and killing South African citizens…
But it is quite another thing to conscript and send 18 year old boys to go fight a war against Marxist terrorists on the Angolan Border whilst you are abetting and smuggling these same Marxist enemies into South Africa and putting them up in safe houses…at taxpayer’s expense.
While these traitors were conspiring to hand over our country to Marxist terrorist scum, young boys were dying on the Angolan border. When these young conscripts were curled up in their sleeping bags in the bush of Angola, unshaved and stinking from not having bathed for days, these traitors were sipping Whiskey with the enemy around a cozy fireplace inside an English Mansion.
In March 1993, 32 Battalion, a crack Special Forces unit and the most decorated, was disbanded and its members left out on their own devices.
Commandant Willem Ratte asked his wife to sew a small black bag together. He then collected 30 old one Rand coins (for their high silver content) from the former soldiers. Commandant Ratte handed the thirty pieces of silver to the battalion's spokesperson, Louis Bothma, with the request that they be given to President F.W. De Klerk. Willie Snyman was a member of parliament at the time. In this capacity, he handed De Klerk his wages of treason on behalf of the soldiers as a symbol of his Judas treachery to the former soldiers who fought Marxism in the Namibian/Angolan Border. De Klerk, according to reports, was very hurt by this gesture.
I have to say, that when the Director of National Intelligence ties the shoelaces of a convicted Marxist Terrorist and mass murder before secret meetings, then you know…You have been properly screwed over.
But what has happened to Dr. Lukas Daniel (Niel) Barnard since the great betrayal?
Well he seems to have invested his thirty pieces of silver quite well in ACG World: Life at the Top (with a whole lot of Nigerians) if one considers who the trustees are.
people like you have a funny way of saying: "we invaded a country, killed the native people of the land and tortured our enemies by calling it "fighting marxism" (which i guess to you has a positive meaning - while i do not know how you can fight a certain way of analysing the modern society - which is essentially marxism - with means of military aggression)!
ReplyDeleteAllways a great laugh when i read blogs like this....Thanks for that!
Mike you seem like a very pathetic, sad creature scorned by the new and old regimes. Please grow up and make something of your life. "Kan jy nie werk kry in die nuwe SA nie?" Dit is net substandaard mense soos jy wat elke dag omwens dat die verlede moet terugkom. 'n Verlede waar jou velkleur en nie jou intelligensie jou plek in die samelewing bepaal het. Ag fooi tog!
ReplyDelete